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Cbr 250R Criticizms...my Take!


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#1 pulsurge

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 04:18 PM

Don’t intend to start a war, but this has been a regular affair being posted across forums on the quality of the CBR250R. This post is not to defend a motorcycle which I bought and I wish to promote so that I encourage others to buy it….no ways, would be getting nothing out of it. I have ridden this bike over 2200 kms now i.e. only commuting involving everyday traffic including bumper to bumper traffic and some 100+ dashes on highways. I guess this given distance is enough for me to make out how good the bike is. Moreover other CBR owners may add in their comments for their prolonged ownership experience on the CBR in comparison.

The CBR is said to be a heavy bike. I always knew that the CBR weighs at 167 kgs- what I didn’t know was that RE bikes weigh nearly the same. But riding wise I never found it heavy, it flicks with great poise in traffic and occasionally even with pillion I go flat out on my commute and to admit frankly I never found my ZMA so effortless as this one. In fact the P220 being lighter in comparison, I find it heavy to negotiate in traffic while crawling and at speeds. I have ridden much lighter bikes- but then I don’t get that stability confidence in case I happen to ride them like the CBR. So is it justified that the CBR is being spotlighted as an elephant and this very point being one of the factors that people add it to its negativity?

Premature conclusions on performance is the next thing. Haven’t ridden the KTM so can’t comment on the ride feel and the acceleration characteristics…though I can vouch that the KTM would give you more thrills than the CBR. In fact it’s obvious one might even end up under the impression that the KTM is much faster than it actually is. The CBR on the other hand would be happy to do all the drudge like a non-complaining housewife without much fuss…the same characteristic which many people loved in the ZMA while choosing it over the P220 despite being lesser on power specs. On the contrary just to add- post 6000 rpm, the CBR does go into a completely different element.

Continuing on similar lines…we have the handling factor. Now without second thoughts the bike that immediately and deservedly springs up is the R15. No arguing on the fact that it’s a great handler- but so much so talks go around that the CBR automatically is highlighted as a bad handling bike- which I feel it is not. I find it way way ahead of the neutral handling of the ZMA which is considered to be a good road-mannered motorcycle. Yes the suspension is soft and the front does dive on hard braking- but then it is what it should be like considering that 99% of the biking population ride their bikes on roads and not on track. If both bikes still had to be taken on track- no guessings who’d be coming out with faster laptimes. Well the CBR has more power would be an obvious comment…but then the P220 with its brute power still trails the R15 on laptimes…its not only about power, isn’t it? If I had to swap the CBR with an R15 for my daily use- within a week I will be coming back crying over a stiff body, I will say the same for the N250R as well. Practicality prevailing on the handling factor- won’t a CBR be a better proposition? Poking in with the KTM here which has a lovely soft suspension- in fact the rear is softer than the CBR at the softest settings- how it performs- time will tell. And finally coming back to the cornering ability here- I really wish to ask the level of skill of a rider who would be cribbing about the ‘not-so-great’ handling of the CBR. At what level of speed will a CBR falter i.e. the bike would lose its line during cornering, the front tyre losing traction or the rear fishtailing. I feel the line of error between the CBR and the R15 will be so much high up the graph that it will need an extremely talented and professional rider to actually push both bikes to a level where the handling limitation would come to light. I found the CBR a completely different animal on cornering when compared to my ZMA- initially I always had apprehensions cornering on the CBR, the first reason being not to crash a new bike and second the cornering technique on the ZMA doesn’t completely apply to this one. It was a very similar case when I rode the R15 for the first time- I was like why the heck is this bike not turning? More of body inputs and the bike reacts to where you want it to go.  I had suspicions on the Contigo which were dismissed when Sheel mentioned that they are as grippy as the ones on the R15…its all in the mind isn’t it? Well coming back to the handling since that I have now started to get the hang of the CBR, I would admit that I have started loving taking corners on it without second and creepy thoughts. In the end I wish to question, a motorcycle excelling on a track would excel in real world conditions? If one has to pick a motorcycle for all round use and had to pick between say an R6 or an FZ6, or a CBR600RR or a 600 Hornet- what would be your choice?

And the issue that bought the CBR into a brighter limelight than the bike itself….QUALITY! Am not sure how deep to go into finding the quality issues. Starting off with the paint- I would rather ask myself as to what a bad quality paint job is. The only two bikes that made me go ga-ga over the paint has been the N250R and the N650R- simply outstanding finish, no other bike can really match them- but I do mind shelling out one bike’s cost for added quality. I can’t really compare the paintjob of the R15 and the CBR here for the fact that the red on the R15 is more maroonish and the one of the CBR that I have is metallic red. I would be grateful if someone could really highlight as to what a bad paint job really means.

Another is the point of criticism….ugly welding joints. Well here are a couple of pics of welding joints of different bikes. The rest are from high res pics sourced from the net except for the CBR.

My CBR- looks real bad?

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The R15: Deltaframe joint looks good, look at the pillion frame weld.
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The N250R…that’s a smooth finish?

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The KTM200….again is that a smooth weld joint? Look at the chassis surface finishing.

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Rusting:

My bike was gathering dust for a month at the godown- thanks to Bank of India who made me run around for one and a half month and finally asking me to go to a branch near my residence to avail the loan. When I got the bike, there was not a micron of rust on the bolts, chain or anywhere.

I was always impressed with the dashboard plastic quality of the R15 with lovely texture and great fitting….I find the CBR no different.

The engine coating on my bike is still as it was when compared to Parimal's first batch CBR (8000+ kms) which had peeling issues right after a few days. Honda was ready to replace the entire block just coz of the peeling from a few places- but he asked them to coat the block instead of replacing as he didn’t want to get into running in again. Though all the bolts were replaced including a new set of grab-rails.

Will end on the note with the words I started with…it’s not a post on defending a motorcycle just coz I have bought. It’s an extremely versatile and it feels a “built-to-go-well-everywhere-motorcycle” the moment you start riding it. And somehow it’s quite bad to see people going too much with criticism on quality and handling comparisons- which I have doubts about at present considering the new batch of bikes. Maybe Honda gave a specially made motorcycle to me. I might be light years away from a rider of a high order- but my riding experience (lotsa commuting and touring as well), I would say the CBR is a great recipe for real world conditions with a gem of an engine that pulls and pulls and pulls…..good stopping power and it excels at whatever you throw at it. Not forgetting to add the lovely EFI that is miserly to the core which during my commuting gives me fantastic mileage figures (35 to 40 kpl). The only grouse I had with my CBR was the quality of the brake pedal and the gear shifter….but then not enough to be a deal breaker to go ahead with.

I genuinely feel that the quality issues were taken care by Honda (one example cited of Parimal) and the new bikes are much much better (mine is one). So as for the bombardment of criticisms, I would say it’s time to look up and beyond and to what the CBR actually is.

Everyone has a right to disagree though.
LIFE IS TOO SHORT FOR TRAFFIC

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#2 satyenpoojary

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 04:27 PM

People will draw comparison, no matter what. Stop being bullied by them.

There is never a best bike, its always the one that best suits you. Like I said earlier as well, for you that is definitely the CBR!

The KTM is too light, and its performance with 'luggage' in mad arse long rides are yet to be seen. Ofcourse it can go through a cross country run, but is it the best fit in that department. I think otherwise.

And thus with R15, its a brilliant track tool. Perhaps one good exmaple of a machine that has undergone a list of changes to cater to the masses without compromising the enthusiasts expectations!


:)

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Ride right, Ride safe, and Ride hard!


#3 Silver Phantom

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:05 PM

Yo Deepak... Good Write, and felt good to read it too...
I completely agree, about your views. i feel the same about my bike too.. as many (countless) have called it an "Uncle's" Bike.. but i think it has done more than any other bike could have done, and has excelled in every dept (I dare anyone to Contradict me ;) ) ..
So if i do upgrade, i do it with a 50/50 weighing of the Heart and Brain...And most probably a CBR250r... :D
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#4 parimal1981

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:15 PM

Nicely put up Deepak.
@Satyen- please do not get me wrong here. The point is nobody including me and Deepak got bullied into buying this bike. Infact I bought this bike as an upgrade to my previously owned zma on the basis of componantry which was available on this bike, looks (very very personal) and most importantly the price which was and is very fair as compared to N250 (or is there a cmparision at all there). The thing that bothered me on Motoroids is have we really evaluated CBR fairly. The basis of Motoroids has been fairness in portraying a brand and it's products the two wheeled and four wheel kinds. I see ktm launch being covered extensively(no complains but still a point. Checked the bike myself and it's a nice bike) you have N250 upgrades being put up with enthusiasm but on other hand when time comes with CBR all people could point out was quality issues. The first real world review of this bike in contrast actually came up right here with Dr. Arnob giving his testimony of 1000 kms on the second day of start of delivery. That's what Motoroids really stands for fairness. I had put up my grouse as well regarding couple of issues I had faced agreed with that as well. But I also mentioned the proactiveness with which the requisite parts were replaced as well. Have we really evaluated other bikes critically, qualitatively, service wise etc I really do not think so. On that note why don't we have a neat road comparo of all the three the CBR, N250 and the ktm by taking a distance of 1000 kms
and see how the three actually fair. Yet again no one should take this post out of context and I stand by Deepaks words. These are my expressions purely as a rider a two wheeled fanatic and there is no intention here to downgrade any individual/ brand/ a specific bike model etc. Infact the scenario in two wheeler industry from consumer's perspective was never so exciting earlier and that's why the above points.

Regards
Parimal

#5 pulsurge

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:21 PM

@Satyen: Not being bullied really :) I had thought to post this way long back- thing is I just did it today.

@CV: Thats the downside of owning a Honda. I've always referred to the Unicorn as "The Silent Killer". No beating drums around- just doing the job without making a fuss.

@Parimal: Waiting for Sanket's KTM, Amit already has a N250- and too many CBRs here...the ride should happen. Just a matter of time ;)
LIFE IS TOO SHORT FOR TRAFFIC

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#6 Silver Phantom

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 06:03 PM

View Postpulsurge, on 08 February 2012 - 05:21 PM, said:

@Satyen: Not being bullied really :) I had thought to post this way long back- thing is I just did it today.

@CV: Thats the downside of owning a Honda. I've always referred to the Unicorn as "The Silent Killer". No beating drums around- just doing the job without making a fuss.

@Parimal: Waiting for Sanket's KTM, Amit already has a N250- and too many CBRs here...the ride should happen. Just a matter of time ;)
I So Blooddy Agree with you ;)
and frankly i see many enthusiastic owners of CBR's. That speaks for itself...:D
Chaitanya Vedak / Silver Phantom
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#7 pulsurge

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 06:13 PM

Well for accounting purpose I made 6 people in my office buy the Unicorn....and boy aren't they happy with it. One has clocked 56,000 kms without a clutch change and it still runs great. Uncle's bike?? Who cares?
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#8 Silver Phantom

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 06:19 PM

View Postpulsurge, on 08 February 2012 - 06:13 PM, said:

Well for accounting purpose I made 6 people in my office buy the Unicorn....and boy aren't they happy with it. One has clocked 56,000 kms without a clutch change and it still runs great. Uncle's bike?? Who cares?
Same here dude. 3 guys from office, and 1 relative...
Chaitanya Vedak / Silver Phantom
~A Motorcycle cant sing in the streets of a City~
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#9 parimal1981

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 06:28 PM

And reason cited are quality issues!! CBR did have a few but one needs to appreciate the effort made by Honda to have them rectified by calling each owner who faced this issue. The newer lot has far less or no issues.

Regards
parimal

#10 razorBlades

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:05 PM

agree with you Deepak on this one!

I frankly did not find any issues with the CBR in the handling part. The only time I rode a CBR was doc's bike and that too first time in Kasara Ghats and the bike handled perfectly in corners. I was comfortable with the bike right from the first gear. Good power delivery since I tried power shifting.

I seriously dont know what the problem is when it comes to Honda and "bikers" :P (pun intended).
Unicorn - Uncle bike
CBZ - show off bike
and now CBR - bad quality?

these are one of the best motorcycles in our country!

But I am getting a KTM :behindsofa:
The only time you'll see me down on one knee, is on my bike!

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#11 Ricci

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:51 PM

I don't know to whom this response ( Deepak's starter post ) is addressed to , I haven't found that much criticism of the CBR250 over handling , only quality. If I were to buy a bike now, the CBR250 is the most likely, the R15 is a the other main contender. Oh now add the faired P200 if/when it comes. While I haven't quite excluded the ZMA , ZMR , P220F either , the CBR250 stands as the bike to buy , Ninja 250R's pricing kills it for me ( and the spares aren't cheap either ). The KTM isn't my kind of bike - but I have yet to see it in person.

Edit: that said, the CBR250R quality is fairly good, though the R15 is the benchmark among domestically made bikes. That little rough weld on the footpeg is not critical , weld on frame/swingarm are. As for paitn quality  - good quality is visible as lustrous , lasting paint , that doesn't lose its shine and/or fade , or chip off and reveal the underlying metal/plastic. The silver (common to all CBR colors ) plastics are poor in terms of paint job, and feel thin/flimsy. Some of the CBRs had good paint , lustre ( red ones that I saw, silver I saw in poor light so can't comment , black was OK but again I didn't see it proper lighting ). The difference in color is irrelevant, the quality of paint is colorblind , so to speak :D

I haven't ridden the CBR250 yet either [ hint , hint , someone lend me one for a couple of weeks :blah:  ] , but being the answer to the Ninja250R as a learner bike , it can't be too twitchy/nervous , it would have to be designed to be steady , stable and calm in its handling characteristics in order to appeal to a wider target customer base. Sort of like the old classic Pulsar (twitchy but agile ) vs the DTSI (longer , more stable ).

Why none of these still hasn't found its way into may parking is a mystery. OK it's not ! :closed_2:
I am saving up for a bigger machine , though the prices are still too high , and now more and more imminent is to get a car to replace the old horse back home, or at least get myself a cage :car:  , which now gets even more urgent - before the gobermint adds that extra diesel tax. :yuck:  :deadhorse:

#12 arn

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 10:24 PM

The handling bit.

From my Kerala ride. The tyre was close to 14500 km at that point. The concavity between the tyre tread and the very edge - gone :D

Posted Image

Note the saree guard put to good use :)

#13 satyenpoojary

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 01:38 PM

I was agreeing with Deepak in my post!

Its just that people remember the bad bits a lot more than the good bits.
The drawing of comparison is actually futile. The three machines are all in different leagues and for different purposes!

Life is tough, only to make you tougher!
Ride right, Ride safe, and Ride hard!


#14 pulsurge

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 01:48 PM

@Ricci: Well I wished to post my thoughts as a reference with mixed doses of ownership experience and facts that clears the air rather storm on the overhyped niggles that people were found quoting on the bike. Welding was not to highlight the critical factor, but to show that quality has to uniform- anyways in the end it was a small thing. If you mean silver plastics by the rear panels- I would say that they are much thicker and harder than the ones on the side fairing cowls. Gobermint...LOL! All the best for your new acquisition....patience is going to see a lot of options. Biking scene in India has never been so good.
LIFE IS TOO SHORT FOR TRAFFIC

A small bunch of my biking memories

#15 Silver Phantom

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 04:07 PM

View Postarn, on 08 February 2012 - 10:24 PM, said:

The handling bit.

From my Kerala ride. The tyre was close to 14500 km at that point. The concavity between the tyre tread and the very edge - gone :D

Posted Image

Note the saree guard put to good use :)

That is some Neat rubber Erosion Doc...
And i hope you punished the Dog that "marked his territory" on your ContiGo's...
The Saree-Guard Mod is also Note Worthy.. Although if it was me, it would be put to use as a Barbeque Grill...Two Small Studds Boxes will do their duty very finely.
Chaitanya Vedak / Silver Phantom
~A Motorcycle cant sing in the streets of a City~
My Personal Snaps and Videos Web Album
My Private Site for my Rides, Drives and Craziness
My Youtube Channel
Blood Group- B-ve:D Attitude- B+ve:D:D




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